Offensive GL Plays

[Dean-Atlanta]

In the instance James mentioned, TWO GL defenses were used on many first and second downs because they functioned like monster blitzes, and were successfully used to destroy a team with a number of sacks.

I agree, this is something that needs no change in this off-season unless there is data we're missing. I only use GL offenses for 3rd and 1 and 4th and 1 so maybe I'm missing some opportunity to game the system using these plays. If there is such a thing, please explain it.

[Steve-LA Chargers]

I see no justification for goal line plays to be used at any time other than goal line situations. I know some coaches use them effectively in 3rd and 1 or 4th and 1 situations all over the field, but my preference is that goal line plays only be used in goal line situations. I'm not going to get in any debate on this - just my preference.

[Charlie-49ers]

Some of what is being questioned are already in the rules! You are not required to use either Goal Line Pass or Goal Line Run Plays, but if you do your plan must have four plays in each of the Goal Line categories.

The following categories can be used but are not required. If used you must have a minimum of:
GOAL LINE
Run = 4
Pass = 4

However, there appears to be room for adjustment as to when a team can use them! Back in the day when we were figuring out what to use where and when Goal Line plays were designed for use inside the 5-yard line on either end of the field; stop the offense from scoring on one end, or hold the offense from getting out from the shadow of their own goal post. Somehow, somewhere we got away from that, and the GLP & GLR plays worked themselves in between the fives! It is logical that we go back to the old days, but we should have a majority of the teams agree.

The 49ers and the four OPEN teams vote yes.

[Justin-Chicago]

Well, back in the day, only two defensive playcalls were required in every situation. Now that three are required in most defensive situations, there is a much stronger case that those categories are viable options than ever before. And of course their inclusion leads to some boom-or-bust big plays, which brings the offense to life a bit, a stated goal for the past few seasons. So I would vote NO.

As to the central topic of this thread, the offensive GL plays, I believe that raising the minimum to three each is supported by every argument that's been presented except the "no rules period" argument. Keep in mind if a team wants to include two timed GLP plays, they would still have to have four total because of the 50% timed rule. True there are only 48 required plays but if one includes the minimum for each type then right now 60 are required, with Jerry's proposal for four each GLP and GLR 64 would be required. That leaves ZERO flexibility to have three timed passes (six total) in any other category, which does not support the offense.

Either leave it all alone, or go to 3 each on the offensive GL plays!

[Dean-Atlanta]

Some of what is being questioned are already in the rules! You are not required to use either Goal Line Pass or Goal Line Run Plays, but if you do your plan must have four plays in each of the Goal Line categories.

The following categories can be used but are not required. If used you must have a minimum of:
GOAL LINE
Run = 4
Pass = 4

However, there appears to be room for adjustment as to when a team can use them! Back in the day when we were figuring out what to use where and when Goal Line plays were designed for use inside the 5-yard line on either end of the field; stop the offense from scoring on one end, or hold the offense from getting out from the shadow of their own goal post. Somehow, somewhere we got away from that, and the GLP & GLR plays worked themselves in between the fives! It is logical that we go back to the old days, but we should have a majority of the teams agree.

The 49ers and the four OPEN teams vote yes.

Are you sure, I just checked and found this:

The following categories can be used but are not required. If used you must have a minimum of:
RUNS
Left = 4
Right = 4
Goal Line = 2
*No more than 2 of the 4 runs can be QB draws*

PASSES
Goal Line = 2

[Dean-Atlanta]

Right now, ALL of the offensive play categories used in the minimum numbers required by the rules totals to 60 plays. There is room for 64 in the game plan. Some of us like to use more than 5 (6 or 8) in the PSL/PSM and/or PML/PMM categories for better balance.

Maybe we should REDUCE the minimums in some of the less used categories to free more space for using more of the heavily used categories like short and medium passing.

[Jerry-Redskins]

The key number is the mandatory number. No one is forced to use the other categories. This makes the 64 limit a non issue as we are discussing a discretionary category. The number needs to be 4 to match the defenses. The offense should have to design and use the same number of successful plays as the defense has to design to defeat it. This is an example of creating a "loop hole" to find one of two plays that work a ton of the time and exploit the defense. My only goal is to put the D and O on equal terms and simplify the rules differences at the same time and continue the creativity. If this is a no, then I would support the plays only be used inside the 5 yard line, which is a direction that we don't have to do as it would add restrictions. Creativity is fine, but it needs to to be balanced in my opinion.

[Justin-Chicago]

Jerry you’re missing on a couple of points.

One, the offense already has a more full game plan than the defense, whether you’re talking mandatory minimums or full representation.

Two, nobody is using GLP or GLR as a loophole that gets called a ton of the time. Review the profile rules, their legality is very restricted. You can’t call them on 1st or 2nd down between the fives unless it’s with a yard to go.

What you’re concerned about simply isn’t happening. If you still think it is, like James said, show us the data from on the field.

[Jerry-Redskins]

The data pops if you game plan a little as there are plenty of examples. I'm sure the Cards noticed the Jets propensity to call PG in the majority of 1 yard to go situations no matter where on the field. Especially as the Cards called PG extensively in the championship game. The Jet Week 7 game is a decent example. In GL situations, I suspect the Jets use PG in a 10-1-1 amount. Maybe not in the other situations, but the potential exist to pick between only two plays 83% of the time and PG was used on multiple downs with 1 yard to go all over the field. If I want to match up and build plays to defend it the best I can do is 83% of four plays. This is a huge difference in play calling. The Jets only need to find two play that work, I have to have four that work. My point is not as much the use as to the unbalanced play calling in a given circumstance. Finding two successful plays is way easier than coming up with four. Even if the rule changed to only inside the 5 yard line it is a big advantage. I may not want to put PG defenses in my game plan, but if I choose to do it for the primary situation they are used I want to have a even chance to guess right while game planning.

RG is similar. Look at the Cards week 18 game. RG was used in multiple situations other than 1 yard to go as well. Such as 2nd and 7 at the 38, 1st and 10, etc. Same issue if I choose to defend it by using the RG D, I should be able to call the plays the same % change if I want to.

Again, the goal is not to stifle the play calling opportunity, just to allow it to be even. Also dropping the GL D's to 2 is the wrong direction in my opinion

[Jerry-Redskins]

The above reference RG on 1st down which is a bad reference in this case as it is using the clock at the end.