Point Betting and Trading

[Jerry-Redskins]

We did a salary cap a few years ago and got rid of it. That's why you see the salary number sin the contract file. The points are a type of a cap that is actually simple. The real cap creates issues in a online league of non-professional part time owners.

[Mitch-Oilers]

Wouldn’t it be nice if we just used a salary cap?

Yes

[Mitch-Oilers]

Wouldn’t it be nice if we just used a salary cap?

Seems like it would simplify things - what was the reason you guys moved away from it anyways? Seems like this would have to be a Charlie/Rich decision because high payroll teams wouldn't want a cap, and low teams would - there wouldn't likely be a consensus.

Here are the PNFL payrolls:

2025
383,740,000 - NYJ
376,365,000 - Hou
374,000,000 - LVR
359,900,000 - Chi
328,825,000 - Wash
300,050,000 - NE
296,790,000 - Den
294,125,000 - GB
289,895,000 - Min
288,300,000 - Jax
263,830,000 - Pit
263,070,000 - Ind
261,745,000 - SF
258,835,000 - Buf
222,325,000 - Sea
210,605,000 - Phi
208,550,000 - Atl
50,500,000 - NYG

2026
420,650,000 - NYJ
396,900,000 - LVR
384,950,000 - Chi
375,550,000 - Hou
365,600,000 - Wash
345,750,000 - Den
340,650,000 - NE
340,650,000 - GB
335,650,000 - Min
318,250,000 - Jax
313,800,000 - Ind
313,600,000 - Buf
307,600,000 - Pit
306,350,000 - SF
269,350,000 - Sea
259,050,000 - Phi
250,900,000 - Atl
59,900,000 - NYG

I loved the salary cap. I found it made it easier to manage my team. However, like with widening the rating between players, too many people are poor managers of their assets and the league has to create a safety net for them.

[Steve-Buffalo Bills]

Time to accept the status quo. Nothing will change with the current points system. With regards to points trading. the most we could do is draw a line in the sand and say you can’t receive points from other teams via trade if you have over 50 points. But I doubt we even consider that. My advice is to accept what we have and GM accordingly.

[Matt-Jacksonville]

We've all been there and we've also had people new to the league that have made mistakes with their allotment. We don't want to get to a point where these teams are punished so much that the coaches leave and never come back. My question to anyone who wants to change the GM side of things as adjusting points rules would do, is how do we make a change that is fair to all involved and provides a mechanism to help those people who mismanage their allotment? There are fewer and fewer of us as time goes on and we want to keep this train rolling as long as we can.

I agree we disallow trading for teams over the annual distribution or we allow it in situations where it's helping out a team that messed up. I'm not against "some" charity, but we don't want to go overboard. There are smarter people that know this stuff way better than I, but at the end of the day we need to make sure we maintain competitive balance and parity and promote an environment where we can keep this going for years to come. Assuming the tech is there to allow us to do so.

[James-Eagles]

After certain trades I am now in favor of removing points from being able to trade. With points it is too easy grossly over pay for a pick. I don't mind allowing bad trades but there comes a point where trading for points is too easy to abuse by teams.

[Steve-Buffalo Bills]

I actually kind of like it. It's causing teams to spend those points. Dean traded 15 points to Shawn for a 2nd round pick in the next draft that most likely will be top 5 (unless Dean has found the new, better version of Fields in Burrows to return his team its 2041 glory). This diminished Atlanta's points considerably. At the same time, Shawn who was at 0.5 points before the trade (due to restructuring costs) now has points to spend on Free Agents. He already spent 10 of those points and is back to 5 for PS insurance. Kind of balanced out,

I'm in the process of hoarding points. I may even trade to get more points. I will eventually spend them in a future season to restructure my remaining superstars through retirement and make a big splash in free agency. So if you guys thought I was losing my mind with the cuts I have made going into this free agency, there is definitely a method to my madness. And getting 8 points from Las Vegas for CB was part of it. I can take a couple of seasons with a weakened roster to be better positioned to build my next contender.

Keep in mind I have suggested that we set a 25 point rollover cap and it was rejected. In this thread, I have suggested not allowing teams with 50+ points to receive points via trade. I know for a fact that none of these will happen. Neither will we see trading of points go away. As such, I'm GMing with this in mind and stockpiling points for a better future.

[Dean-Atlanta]

I traded for that 2nd round pick in 2047 from the Giants, whether it is top depends on how the Giants do this season. But I traded my 2047 1st round pick for QB Joe Burrow, and can arguments for or against that trade. By skill ratings, is he that much better than Hendon Hooker? What he does on the field, we will see. But I suspect many of you will think Charlie has made a good gamble on trading for that draft pick given these stats on my team over the last ten season.

There are the win-loss records and points for/ points against for the last 10 seasons.

2045 2-14 340 490
2044 5-11 334 414
2043 5-11 386 483
2042 7-9 305 380
2041 10-6 328 355
2040 5-11 269 388
2039 10-6 361 280
2038 5-11 245 372
2037 4-12 256 383
2036 4-12 305 408

The ONLY season my defense was respectable was the 2039 season when KC went 10-6 and made the playoffs. That was the rookie season of Justin Fields. Even the 2041 season Steve mentioned, my defense gave up 355. 2039 was second most productive offense of those ten seasons. The best offense was 386 points in 2043, that lead to only 5 wins because my defense gave up 483.

Joe Burrow could have a MVP type season and lead the team to scoring 400+ points and it would go to waste if my defense gives up 480.

[Steve-Buffalo Bills]

Yeah I had it backwards. You are betting a lot of points that the NYG will struggle again thus making that 2nd worth it. Same with SF giving up Burrows for your 1st. Charlie is hoping it gets him in the top 5 of the 2047 draft. I’m willing to bet both ATL and NYG play better this season mainly based on their roster improvements though. Burrows will matter for ATL. Your passing game will be scary. NYG running game will be revived with T Bolles on their OL. Need to focus on defense though for sure.

My roster is much weaker than last season and will have lots of rookies too. I will be a good test for Jerry’s theory that every point matters for player ratings. I have a different theory I’m exploring as I have mentioned. It’s what I call the rating threshold theory. I’m convinced that after a certain threshold player ratings is met going beyond that threshold doesn’t matter as much as we think.

[Dean-Atlanta]

The test I did 2 off-season ago when I tested my PPP/my roster vs my PPP/Jerry's roster showed tiny statistical differences in points for and against per games based on 200 simmed games for each. This results seems to be very much inline with your threshold theory of player skill ratings. We will see ikn future PNFL seasons if some of those players fall below the threshold.